The Legend

The Legend

Tuesday, June 2, 2015

Bunting 101 (rant time)

Hot take time!

If you watch enough baseball little things start to irritate you. I've discussed a few on here before with bullpen roles and the DH. My next one is probably more of an offshoot of the DH issue, but it still drives me bat shit crazy.

I'm not a Moneyball driven "you should never bunt" guy.  As long as the pitcher has to bat in the NL, bunting is a necessary evil. Instead of being overly wordy, I think list form will paint a good picture of when I think it is a good time to bunt.



Good times to bunt


  • Pitchers 
  • Crazy fast players bunting for hits (Dee Gordon, Billy Hamilton etc.)
  • Beat the shift
The first bullet point is a no brainer. Until MLB gets their act together and puts the DH in the NL we will have to suffer through pitchers attempting to bunt. Watching them bunt is usually much better than watching them hit.

Dee Gordon started to figure out last year that if you put the ball on the ground good things will happen. This year he has been crazy good and through the first couple months of the season he has been one of the most valuable players in baseball. While he won't be able to keep up this pace, Gordon continues to evolve as a hitter. Billy Hamilton is probably even faster than Dee Gordon, but he cannot get on base to save his life. Hamilton tends to be pretty fly ball happy, so learning how to bunt could be a better way to utilize his one tool.

Beating the shift is probably the most debatable of any of these on the list. I'm still on the fence. Bunting is not easy to do. It takes a brave soul to step in the batter box and try to bunt high 90's heat. That might be reason enough to remove it here. I kept it here because a few players have actually started to do this with decent success. Mike Moustakas has learned to bunt and slap hit the other way which has helped him get on base at the highest rate of his career. 

Learning to bunt to beat the shift would play a huge role at the end of games. How many times have you seen the big lefty power hitter ground out into the shift late in games down by two runs. It is very frustrating. You can't hit a two run homer with no one on base. If teams want to score more runs they will have to find ways to beat the shifts. 

Overrated times to bunt 
  • Any sac bunts not involving the pitcher
  • high leverage situations
I hate seeing position players give up outs in the middle of game to move a runner up. I about threw my remote through the tv a couple weeks a go when Neil Walker put a sac bunt down.  He was batting cleanup. The Pirates are blessed with a good bit of team speed. Stealing is better % play. 

The high leverage situation bunt is the favorite of most managers. In theory it seems like the smart move, but statistics show that it really doesn't change win expectancy. For one, most position players are poor bunters. Just as much can go wrong with a bunt than letting someone swing away. The best case scenario is that you get the bunt down and advance the runner to second. This will usually cause the next batter to be intentionally walked. Many times this takes the bat of a good hitters hands. The way bullpens are set up you might put yourself in a scenario where you are forced to face a ground ball specialist or a bad lefty/lefty combination. 



At least in the Pirate situation they have pretty much gotten away letting any of their main position players bunt in those situations.

What is your take on your teams handling of these bunting scenarios? 

Thanks for reading. 

















18 comments:

  1. "Watching them (pitchers) bunt is usually much better than watching them hit."

    Despite being pro-DH/pro-both DH & PH, I have one exception, Bartolo Colon. Then again watching him do anything gives our lives meaning.

    I remember seeing Cano turn a bunt that went into the left side of the infield (where the third baseman was standing at the SS position) and got him to second base. It was awesome.
    Although I've seen Ichiro (the best hitter of all time) try to bunt and fail numerous times so I doubt that bunting to beat the shift or to try to get on base is as easy as it sounds.

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    1. Bartolo Colon is a national treasure.

      That is the thing with trying to beat the shift. I agree that it would be extremely difficult. That is why I wasn't sure if it should be on the list, but more and more guys are able to get it done.

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  2. To me, there is really just one time you shouldn't bunt, and even then there is a little leeway. Never bunt in the last 3 innings if the pitcher has a no hitter and no one is on base. That's cheezy. However, there is a time you can bunt in that situation.

    1-0 score.

    If the pitcher only has a one run lead and is working a no hitter, if you need to drag bunt to get on, then do it. The unwritten rule goes out the door when you are down only a run.

    But normally, anything is the right time to bunt. Third baseman playing too far back? Bunt. Speedy man on first with one out? Bunt. Slow pitcher and first baseman? Push it down the line and leg it out.

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    1. DISAGREEMENTS!

      I'm the exact opposite. I think the times to do it are few and far between. If I'm a manager I don't want to waste my position players at bats by sac bunting.

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  3. I'm in favor of bunting for hits -- things like power hitters beating a shift with a well-placed bunt are high comedy and smart baseball.

    Sacrifice bunting, though, is reserved for only one situation I can think of: runner on 3rd, less than 2 outs, bottom of the 9th (or bottom of any later inning) and 7th game of the World Series. And then you bunt only if the runner misreads the signs and thinks he is supposed to do a straight steal of home and you're bunting suicide-squeeze style.

    Otherwise? Pitchers only, thanks.

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    1. Sac Bunts will probably almost go extinct once the NL gets the DH. I think the only time you will see managers still do it will be in the highest leverage situations. In the Pirates case they are rarely doing it anymore. The only time I seem them do it is when the bottom of the order is up. I think they realized that they would rather see guys like Cutch and Marte swing away rather than bunt or get intentionally walked as the result of the bunt.

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  4. I couldn't agree more with you Matt. I know Whitey Ball is never coming back-but Matt Adams will not or can't bunt when given a shift that puts the third baseman at the shortstop position! Thus leaving the entire third base side vacant.

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    1. The shift thing would probably have to be a team oriented decision rather than the player just periodically trying to do it. If the opposing team knows that you have a bunch of guys that will bunt to beat the shift you would have to think the defense would have to realign accordingly.

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  5. Outs are precious.
    If bunting is the best chance for a player to reach base safely, then yeah, let's bunt!
    If moving the runner up a base is easier via the bunt than swinging away, yeah, let's bunt!

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    1. I think that pretty well sums it up because option 1 is your speed demons and option 2 sounds like the pitcher.

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    2. There are certainly times when you've got a weak hitter at the plate (or even a guy in the middle of a long slump) where bunting a guy over is much more desirable than having the batter ground into a double play. Getting guys over to 2nd and 3rd with one out is better than a runner at 3rd and two outs...

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    3. Even if the struggling hitter gets the bunt down, would't the team just walk the next guy and the double play will still be in order. I just feel like that would only be desirable in 9th inning. In the middle of game fell like that giving up an out is a bad play.

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    4. Would it always be sounds strategy to walk the next guy? Depends on the lineup card. Bases loaded with one out is also better than runner on third and two outs...

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    5. I guess my issue is that you are assuming the bunt will work in the first place. If slumping guy is asked to bunt couldn't he bunt into a double play, force out at third, strike out. Swinging away may cause a double play too, but he could get a hit, draw a walk etc.

      Like you said a lot is lineup dependent. In the Pirates case they almost never bunt in this situation unless it is the pitcher.

      I just feel that their is not much reward to bunting in these situations. That is what makes these kind of debates so much fun. Their really is no right answer.

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    6. yeah- there are infinite situations in terms of score, # of outs, where you are in the lineup, who's pitching, home vs road, what inning it is... I would trade an out for bases only in certain situations.

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    7. nope. Gardenhire used to have the Twins bunting every now and then early in the game, but Molitor is more interested in guys hitting their way on and then stealing / hit and run / taking an extra base to move up. They called for a delayed steal last night that put a guy in scoring position with two outs, but unfortunately Danny Santana was hitting.

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    8. Poor Danny Santana.....

      Clint Hurdle use to be an "old school" manager, but after the 2012 season they went full throttle new wave thinking.

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